CichlidFish.com - Fish That Think.

So, here's the story. I've got 4 yellow labs in a 29 gal, ammonia and nitrites at 0, ph around 8.5 and the biggest female started carrying eggs. I got real excited, and worried about maybe needing to remove her, but never ended up doing it. After carrying around a week, all of a sudden the bulge in her throat goes away. I think she must have eaten the eggs. Next time she gets around to breeding, do any of you have any ideas about keeping her from eating the eggs? I've heard of stripping them from her, but have no clue how to do it. Any information on either of this would be most appreciated.
Thanks for the help.

hi! welcome to the forum.
doing this task isnt an easy one but generally it involves catching and holding the female while various methods are employed to coax her to release the fry. These range from having the female in a turkey baster or similar, head downwards, to release the fry through the bottom, to gently prising the mouth of the female open with a pencil... Personally I am not in favour of these methods, as I believe they all involve a fair amount of stress for the female. Some experienced breeders who use these methods say they are not overly stressful. However, it is likely that some of the techniques could take a while to become skilled at, and those attempting them for the first time might find them stressful to both fish and owner!

A better method might be to catch and isolate the female to her own small tank, and allow her to release the fry naturally. This could be a small 10 gallon tank with a heater and simple sponge filter. Add a cave or two to give her some security, and fill the tank using water from the main tank when you are ready to catch and transfer her. When she has naturally released the fry (patience required!), it would be ideal to move the female to a second small tank so that she can recover from the ordeal and be fed properly, before returning her to the tank.

hope this helps.

okay, thats great and all, but have you ever tried to catch an african when they have decided they don't want to get caught?
Its not an easy thing, to say the least.
Any tips on netting them in the first place would be appreciated as well. My goal is to not destroy all of the decoration I have in the tank (mostly stacked slate) as this also will add a lot of stress to the fish.
Oh, by the way, I added another two Labs to the 29 on the advice of a friend.

Originally posted by Deepseafisher
okay, thats great and all, but have you ever tried to catch an african when they have decided they don't want to get caught?

lol:D

--Mark:cool:

Mark, I saw your subject line...very interesting.
How do I make or where do I buy an african trap? Any more infor about them at all would be most appreciated.
Every time I decide its about time I caught and seperate one of my africans, I just about decide to switch to something easier, because they drive me insane. The behavior of the fish is definitely worth the trouble, though.

i put a lot of small individual caves (line those neon caves sold in the petstore). usually pregnant fish, stressed fish, etc.would tend to hide in a cave. i just quietly and quickly put the net on top of the cave, it is a small one that just a little bit bigger than the cave. the cave has a flat bottom, and then reach my hand and turn the net and cave upside down and just scoop the fish out with the cave on the fish, and then dump the whole thing in the maternity tank or hospital tank. works 99% of the time.

even better, i got two vase with a small mouth, about 1.5 diameter holes, and everytime the fish i am about to catch went into those vase, it is a piece of cake to catch, i just put the net on the openning, and chances they will hide inside, and not jump out.

Great ideas. I found out through personal messaging that there is no such thing as african traps...oh well. I will certainly try those next time though. Thanks for the help.

The big female is carrying eggs again...:hurray: I put a piece of pvc with a stopped up end in the tank in hopes of the female choosing this as a nice hiding spot, at which point I can snatch her out. The 10 gal is ready and waiting, I assume 10 gals. will be enough for her. I have got convict fry in the 10, does anyone know if these will be any problem to her? They are too big for her to eat, but will they pester her any? Maybe with a little luck and some more knowledge something will eventuate this time.

I ended up just netting the female recently, and put her in an empty 15 gal. Now shes just in there, alone, with filtration, a heater and a cave to hide in. Do I need to feed the fry anything? I know that normally I do, but I read somewhere that the fry of mouthbrooders dont even come out for something around three weeks? If I don't feed them, what will they eat? Just curious. I'm going to put a rock with algae in the tank just in case the female is letting them out only when I'm not around. As always, I appreciate any help.

I'm sure your female has spit her fry by now but I thought I would mention a couple things I've had success with. I've found the best way to catch a fish is to do it at night after the lights have been out for at least a couple hours. Grab a flashlight and your net and you'll be amazed how easy it is. Of course, you want to move your decorations from time to time anyway when you do water changes but you shouldn't need to disturb them too much to catch her this way. DO NOT use a back filter with fry, you almost MUST use a sponge filter or the fry will get sucked up unless you get a sponge to go over the intake. Also keep in mind that while the fry will grow faster with the temp at 80 degrees rather than 74-76, there will be less oxygen in the water at a higher temp. and 20% water changes are required daily if you feed 2-3 times per day to suck up all the waste from your fry. If you do this the fish will grow so fast you won't believe your eyes!

Use 2 nets, works every time. or failing 2 nets (it easier to control) use a clear plastic bag on a length of wire, the fash cant see it... they fight like hell when their in it though.

However, im sure if she gets unduelly stressed, as shes bound to if you try to net her shell eat the fry anyway.

Peace out.

The female ate her fry again a few days ago, or maybe they were sucked into the filter. I don't know, other than that they are all gone. I fed her up and shes back in the main tank now. I will try the few hours after lights out idea. I think thats a good one. 2 nets makes things easier, but it's still really hard. Anyone know how long it'll take her to have a batch succesfully?

How soon do you feed the tank that she's in after they spawn? I always wait at least 2 days before feeding and then I leave her in until 12-14 days. At this point fry should be free swimming and it reduces stress on the mother because she can start eating sooner. So after about 2 weeks I catch her in a large net, get a plastic toothpick from my swiss army knife, and hold her very gently at the surface of the water and pry her mouth open just enough to let the fry out. Then I move her up and down along the surface of the water while holding her mouth open until it appears all of the fry are flushed out in my net and move them to a cycled 10 gallon with a sponge filter and heater set identical to the tank she's in. Sometimes they will eat their first spawn or two but eventually they get it right... If not you may have to strip her shortly after spawning and get an egg tumbler if you want to raise the fry.

Did some pming with africancichlidc, and next time I'll start feeding them real food instead of just an algae covered rock. Silly me. Oh well... I appreciate the detailed info on stripping her of the fry. I searched the net over and was unable to find anything that actually said anything about how to strip the fry. I also will be sure to have a sponge filter in the 10, in case the internal filter I had running made too much curent.

Well, knowledge is power, and maybe the third time will be the charm.

Appreciate the help.

Well, the third time came around 2 weeks ago, only this time it was a different female. (score!):D

I haven't got room to remove them to a second tank this time, so I am going to just let nature take its course. I added some breeding grass and a sort of a "spawning mop" (I know that term is technically in reference to something you use breeding Killifish, but thats what it looks the most like) to give the fry a better chance at survival in the main tank. At this point, the female is still holding. Hoping she'll release soon.

A quick question, do I need to be feeding the tank anything special? If so, how can I insure that the female is able to get the food to the babies?