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I was contemplating starting a saltwater tank, and was wondering if it is much more difficult than a reg freshwater tank? I know that there are somethings that are different, I know that there is protein skimmer. Please let me know the materials that i need to get and what kind of maintainance is required to get this started. I am thinking about if i decided to start a saltwater tank I would try to start a 30 gal and practice with some small saltwater fish and see how it goes and if it does alright then i would upgrade and get a larger tank and some new fish and larger tank and materials.

Saltwater can be a bit tricky but isnt really hard as long as you are up to the challenge. first of all you need to understand that in the ocean water quality NEVER changes... so if your tank water gets even slightly dirty you are in for trouble. You need to be able to provide a relatively stable enviroment otherwise you will do like many people and be fine for several months then your tank will crash and you will have to start from scratch.

That being said you can set up a tank for virtually the same cost as a freshwater tank if you are prepared to do weekly maintenance. This means having a place to have premixed and aged saltwater on hand at all water change dates. Or you can set the tank up for about 100x's that of a fresh water tank and do it right with live rock. I think you could set up a 30 gallon tank for roughly $150-300(depending on local price usually $5-10 per/lbs) worth of rock or 1 lbs per gallon.

As you can tell I dont recommend doing a tank without live rock I think it is a mistake and would even go so far as to recommend not even trying if you dont... but it is possible to do with out so I wont. Other then that you can have 1" of fish per 5 gallons during the first 6 months then another 1" per 5 gallons after that if you use live rock. So that means you need to choose your fish pretty carefully.

All in all I think my salt tank is very rewarding and not that much more difficult then my freshwater tanks now that I am used to it. If you are serious about setting one up I would go buy 2-3 books that discribe how to set up your first tank and read them each twice before buying anything the more you read the better it will be.... There is so much info regarding setup that it would take quite a while to try and explain it all outright, so if you have some specific questions that would make it a little easier for me... I could probably write myself into carpel tunnel syndrome otherwise It would be good to have another bloke around who is into salt water so if I can help anymore just let me know.

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Adam

Save the animals, eat a PETA member!
Email me: Adam@cichlidfish.com
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well then I will try to get myself more info before i rush into it. I do like to know what I am doing, and i am always wanting to know more about fish and really any animal that I can learn about, especially when I can use my knowledge to help out another. The good thing is that my new job permits me to be on the internet when I am at work, so I can keep up with you guys and learn more and offer some assistance whenever I can. I will try and get out and get a saltwater starter book this weekend, and will look around and price some live rock. I remember hearing something about a protein skimmer, Is this a necessity, or what is its function? I have also seen before where people have larger saltwater tanks and they have a smaller tank below that they cycle the salt and water through. Is this helpful and would a 10 gal be sufficient for a 30 gal, also does this water pump or circulate through the other tank, and what is needed? I am sorry to hit you with so many new questions, but I do like to learn. I will be getting that book hopefully this weekend, and then I wont have as many obvious questions to ask you, and might be able to help another beginner out at some point.
Thanks to all of the mediators, especially adam and tony, for all that you do for me and the others on this site!!

The tank under the tank is called a sump, it is where you would do all your filtration, run your protein skimmer and where your heater would be... they are very nice since you can keep all your devices out of the main tank. it also adds more volume which is good in SW since fluxuations in water quality and specific gravity are bad. 10 gallons would probably be sufficient, if you can a 15 would be better... a sump 1/2 the size of the main tank is suggested. Yes the water flows from the main tank down to the sump then up into the main tank again via several options... I suggest having your tank predrilled with stand-pipes as these are much more preferable to siphons.

The protein skimmer is a device that through various techniques (wood block, venturi, turbulence) produces huge amounts of bubbles... tank water is run through these and proteins and wastes attach themselves to these bubbles then the bubbles rise to the surface and out into a collection cup. It is similar to walking on the beach and seeing that brown scummy foam on the sand... the wave action does a similar effect with the surf and that brown sludge you see is what will be coming out of your tank... they are generally speaking a necessity there are some setups that dont need them but they are more of an advanced project.

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Adam

Save the animals, eat a PETA member!
Email me: Adam@cichlidfish.com
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I was just wanting to check up on a saltwater lfs that i went into the other day. I did take your advice and i ordered a saltwater book online, and while i was at it i saw 2 freshwater books that i thought would be good to have, so i got them as well. I am going to read the books before I start my tank. I was wanting to make sure that you agree with what he told me as well as ask a couple of quick questions that i have read the past few days. He thinks that i should start out with a damsel or 2 for 3 to 4 weeks or until my tank cycles. He recommended that i remove the freshwater and all gravel and let tank dry and get filtered water and add crushed coral and salt and then the damsels and keep checking the water and when it is cycled then I would be able to add a clown and a trigger. Could I add these fish in a 30 gal tank once it has cycled? He also suggested that I get a emperor filter, but i dont remember the size. I am considering getting a new filter, as mine is almost 2 years old and i dont want it to burn out while i have my new fishies in the tank, as i have had some problems with it in the past, so i thought as a precaution i would just get a new filter. Do you think that this filter would be alright and what size do you think that he was talking about? He said 30 lbs crushed coral. Does that sound right?
also i read something about hagen instant ocean salt as being good salt. What kind do you recommend?
I have heard a lot about live sand. Is the live sand similar to live rock in how it works and what its function is?

Thanks for all of your help Adam, hopefully my books will come in the mail soon and then you wont get sooo many obvious questions!

Ok here is what I would do...

get 30-40 lbs of live rock with enough "base" rock (dead live rock, your lfs should sell it dry by the pound) to keep the live rock above the sand level which should be 4" thick. Sand should be sugger fine aragonite dont get crushed coral you will end up changing it out sooner or later for the finer stuff anyway trust me. Get a protein skimmer rated for up to a 100 gallon tank, and run this during the cycle... dont add any fish for the first 3-4 weeks or until it is cycled. There should be enough die off on the LR to supply you with copious amounts of ammonia... if not just add some raw shrimp... never cycle a saltwater tank with fish... I dont know why people recommend it. If you want to have damsel fish then by all means do so, but it should be your last fish purchased they are mean little bastards and should never be the first fish in the tank unless that is all you ever want to have in it. After the tank cycles add the clown fish, wait a week, buy the trigger and quarentine it for 5-6 weeks (if you choose not to quarentine, which is a bad idea, then wait a month not a week). depending on the trigger you may not be able to add many more fish. For the first 6 months you will be limited to 1 fish a month, to a maximum of 6" of fish (always account for the fish at adult size). Most triggers get about 6-8" and some get bigger, clowns get to about 4" so at adult size you would be limited to those 2 fish perminantly(rule of thumb is 1" of fish per 5 gallons of saltwater)... if you are okay with that then you are all set. After 6 months it is okay to add an additional 6" of fish to the tank for a total of 12" of adult size fish. with the 2 above mentioned fish you are already at that point so dont worry about it. You can add more.. but if you do look out because eventually you will be in for some sort of trouble and that usualy spells dead fish. I think I covered everything... but if not let me know what else you want to know

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Adam

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Well adam has steared you well.
First of all triggers will limit you in the future.....may not want to make that commitment yet but it is up to you :-)

The trigger and clown relationship could become a problem depending on what type of trigger and what type of clown you are wanting to get.

For the best chances you'd want to make the clown wild caught and not tank raised(the tank raised are easier..another trigger limit) because the wild caught seem to know better. The tank raised most likely had never seen an aggressive fish other than his brother :-) and would not know what to do...IME.

A picasso trigger stays rather small for most of it's life....it is said to reach 9" in the aquarium but I've had one for a year now and it has grown maybe 3/4" So it would take a while for it to reach any size at all...and mine is in a 125. So that may be one of your better bets If you are wanting a trigger.

Several triggers get well over 12 inches, and would be an obvious bad choice.

You'd also want to get a good sized clown I'd reccomend say a clarks clown full grown...wild caught. Or any other Big clown...wild caught.

Also you want to think about in the future you can't have snails or crabs or basically anything. Because the trigger's wont have that, well they will for lunch but....that is an expensive feeding.

I mean it is all up to you but make sure you really want the triger before you get it. They really limit what you can do in the future and it is always fun to add stuff to your tank.

Also if you get the trigger that willl be the end of buying fish othe rthan maybe one fish....and it could be trouble if you get a trigger with a bad attitude.

If you have any questions on triggers and what not post em up.

My thanks to both of you! I am going to read my books first and then start up my tank. If I come up with any other questions then i will let you know.

What type and size of filter would you recommend that I get for this tank? It is 29 tall. And also air stones are not used in salt water correct?

Well for your tank you want to be looking at turning the water over about 10x's an hour, that is including power heads, skimmer pump and filter. Your filter also should only be mechanical in nature... your rock and deep sand bed are the bulk of your biological filter any more and you tend to over produce nitrates. I would get 2 powerheads of about 150 gph(one at each end of the tank pointed towards each other). then a power filter that is rated for your tank with only sponge media in it, and then a skimmer rated for 75 gallons or smaller tanks. That will give you plenty of turn over and filtration

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Adam

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Adam@cichlidfish.com
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I also was wondering and I was told that I need to use filtered purified water for water changes and water setup. I wouldnt mind doing this for the initial setup, but i was hoping to avoid having to do this for my weekly water changes. Is filtered water necessary? If not what should I use to clean the water up with for a saltwater tank, Do you have a specific chemical that you use?

Thanks

I know many people use de-chorinated tap water to top off the tank and do water changes... I personally dont recommend it... I would get a RO or DI unit to clean your water... phosphates and nitrates will cause major problems in your salt tank even the small amounts found in tap water... My algea blooms all but stoped when I switched to DI water... I rent a unit from culligan for $16 a month... totally worth knowing there is not funky stuff going into my tank

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Adam

Come see my website!
Adam@cichlidfish.com
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Or you can go to most lfs's and buy the di water Here it's 1.00 for 5 gallons...and since I don't do water changes but once every one-two months I really don't need the thing. Just depends

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Clint
CDevoe1111@aol.com

I have a question about a protein skimmer that i found on www.bigalsonline.com
it was berlin air lift 60 or the air lift 90. it is made by red sea. Is this skimmer worth getting they are rated for up to 60 and up to 90. I also found an interesting one that didnt have any air stone or anything to replace and had its own motor included with it and no pump needed. I cant remember what it is called i will have to look it up on thatpetplace.com but it didnt use a stone just a motor that made small bubbles. Do you think that any of these would be alright to use in my tank?

well as far as I know the berlin skimmers are pretty good quality... I would get one that has an independent powerhead/pump... that way you can easily replace it if it burns out, with out having to have the whole skimmer repaired or replaced... most models have this type of set up... also get a venturi driven skimmer instead of the air stone ones they are way more efficient and dont need to be replaced all the time.

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Adam

Come see my website!
Adam@cichlidfish.com
Got ?'s about HITH? Read this to learn more!