CichlidFish.com - Fish That Think.

Is there any immediate way to help fish that are totally infested with ICH???? I feel so bad and helpless for these poor guys.

I have 4 (had 5) pictus catfish, and a columbian shark who are suffering so bad and I want to give them some relief now as the super ich cure is not working that quickly. I've added salt and raised the temp a bit but it's been 4 days now and they show very limited progress. The other scaled fish in the tank don't seem to be botherd by it yet and I don't think the one pictus is going to live much longer.

I have always put in salt so I'm fairly surprised that they have it, and that bad too.
The only thing I can think happened is that I bought these shrimp pellets for my Banjo catfish to eat at night, these stupid things turn into mush within about 30 sec to 1 min. By the time I noticed that and tested the water the ammonia was horribly high. I did a massive water change, then a smaller change two days later, and then again today, the ammonia is now between .25 and .5, the nitrite is 0.

I would really appreciate any ideas that may help these poor guys right now. (I have already increased the amount of salt, and it may have helped a little I dont' really know).

Thanks in advance

The raised temp is the most effective thing in the killing off of ICH in my opinion but it can only effect the ICH at a certain stage in the ICH lifecycle. It may take a week or two to be sure you have dealt with all the ICH as the life cyle will be staggered.

To explain the cycle more and why it might take awhile ..the first stages of Ich are called 'trophozoites' and this is when you notice the white spot on the fish, at this point it is very difficult to effect through temp or any meds at all. They then mature over a span of days into whats known as 'trophonts' and fall off the fish onto the bottom of the tank (and any decor, plants etc). These 'trophonts' that have fallen off the host fish then release up to 1000 or so 'tomites'. These 'tomites' then become free swimming looking for a new host fish which must be found within about 3 days. It is only in this free swimming stage whilst looking for a host that the high temp. (and a lot of meds) will have any great effect on them, they are relatively unable to withstand temps higher then about 75-78f at this stage. If they are not killed during this transfer stage between tank floor and host then they re-attach and the whole cycle begins all over again so the chance was missed and treatment will have to be continued.

(hope that's understandable, the way the cycle works also explains why usually all fish in the tank will break out at once aswell).

Over a week or so you should of experienced at least 2 cycles (allthough they will be stagered) which should ensure that you have got rid of them with the high temp.

What size tank are they in, and how many fish. ICH is not generally an overly fatal type of problem. Most fish who are healthy, and have a good immune system, will survive an ICH infestation. However in crowded tanks, and weakened fish, ICH is most often fatal, and the infestation seems to be most sever.
I am not sure of the reasons, maybe its because the ICH can find a host body easier in an overstocked tank, or the overstocking/stress has caused the fish's slim coat to be thinner than normal, however the evidence is factually, regardless of the why's.
I suspect the overstocking is an issue, due to your ammonia spike, and that is why I mention it. In most cycled tanks, where stocking is not a concern, over feeding once in a while would not lead to an ammonia spike.

Other than what I mentioned above I have 3 baby angels, 2 baby female betas, a pleco, and a couple of cory doras. Now that I think about it.... the ammonia spike may not have been a major factor in the outbreak. I bought 2 ramshorn snails about a week or two ago and the lfs I got them from is also having a problem with ICH, but at the time everything in thoes tanks seemed fine.

As for the overfeeding..... it was over a few days that I put thoes shrimp pellets in for my banjo, I don't need to do a water change in that tank anymore than once a week. The picture on the can shows a corydora so I thought it was perfect, but it litterally disolves into almost a powder in about 1 min. I don't have alot of gravel in the tank but they still can't get to the mush. I expect to have to move them to a bigger tank, but I didn't think that the size of the fish would make it overstalked would it????

Thanks for the help and insight, it's great.

You need to raise the temp to 84F and leave it their until the ICH falls off..WAIT 2 days,,Then turn the heater to 80F and leave it their for the duration of the treatments, then you turn it to the normal setting and let the water temp come down on its own...Once you see they are off the fish, VACUMM the gravel really good..probley a good time for a water change about then..then remed the tank..and follow the directions..

Thanks Barb,

I've lost another pictus today:( , and one of the others that was badly infected isn't looking very good:( The two I'm probably going to be left with and my columbian shark are looking cleaner, and acting a bit happier.

I've got another question, does the extra salt and super ich cure kill the good bacteria??? Last night the amonia was down to about .25..... I just did another test and it is now 1+......... I also put in some ammolock last night also......

And.... does the raised temp have a negative effect on angel fish? The two babies I have are in the top corner with their fins clamped. None of the other fish have any sign of ich but I'm getting really concerned about the ammonia.

Many thanks to everyones help,

The meds are probley the reason the fish are in the top corner. Also you need to really get a lot of air into the tank! This is very important due to the temp will deplete the air in the water..

One problem with using some ICH meds is some of the fish can not handle it at full straigth. I know you have been treating the tank, but you might want to not do the full straigth..A water change wil help the fish if they show signs of distress and also dulute down the meds...

Water Changes are the best defence for high Ammonia. Easy on the feedings. Maybe do only once daily for now..YOU can still do water changes while you med the tank..This is VERY IMPORTANT to maintain a clean tank and to keep the paramiters from getting out of hand..Like now with the Ammonia..

The ex-salt should not interferr with the good bacteria. BUT the ICH meds may..READ the lable and see if their is a warning..
I would NOT add in anymore salt to the tank, NOT even on the NEXT 4 water change depending on how much U added in..
Scaleless fish are very likely to die with the use of some ICH meds.

AHH...... the light shines a little brighter now... lol

Thanks again Barb, I did end up loosing that other pictus...... everyone else is doing alot better. I did add another air stone for the temp problem.
TTFN:)